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Sebastian Delcampe presents the future of Delcampe!

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  • stevehillstamps
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    Thanks for letting us know about this baltija.

    A couple of important changes coming later this year that I was not aware of.

    First delcampe fees will be taken from the buyer payment when paid by the buyer (as ebay does now) rather than at month end to minimise non payment of fees to delcampe.

    Secondly, there is going to be a monthly large shop fee for sellers with over 1000 items which is graduated from EUR4.95 (1001+ items) to EUR249.95 (Million+ items) as per the screen shot below. How this fits in with the club+, and whether this is addition to this we will see when formally announced. Buyers may have less choice in future if too many larger sellers remove items to accommodate this.

    I was half expecting them to slightly bump the fee percentage to cover for the lost mangopay fees but thankfully that is not the case (for now)

    Delcampe, this ought to have been announced with videos and transcripts in all languages you support. You can do better.
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  • stevehillstamps
    stevehillstamps 100% (14520x)
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    Ther is also a large thread on the french forum with additional answers on. It seems there are changes to club+that I missed in the subtitles.

    Vinculo (https)
  • grahamshanghai
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    I agree that it is disappointing that this has been announced in this way. I only discovered it because I check the Forums at least weekly. It should have been issued as a proactive email to all users in multiple languages.

    I have tried to work out what is happening from the French forum and with Google Translate etc but it is not straightforward. I could not get subtitles to work on the video.

    I could not find, for example, any indication of WHEN these changes are coming into force ? Next week ? Next month ? In six months ?

    I am also puzzled by the suggestion that Delcampe is going to add 10% to all prices. The cost of listing/marketing on the site should be borne directly by the seller, not the buyer.

    Thanks !
  • stevehillstamps
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    I agree that it is disappointing that this has been announced in this way. I only discovered it because I check the Forums at least weekly. It should have been issued as a proactive email to all users in multiple languages.

    I have tried to work out what is happening from the French forum and with Google Translate etc but it is not straightforward. I could not get subtitles to work on the video.

    I could not find, for example, any indication of WHEN these changes are coming into force ? Next week ? Next month ? In six months ?

    I am also puzzled by the suggestion that Delcampe is going to add 10% to all prices. The cost of listing/marketing on the site should be borne directly by the seller, not the buyer.

    Thanks !
    The video mentioned May/June as a timeframe for the next changes, but they are still working on the implementation so is not set in stone.

    As you suggest, my understanding is that the fees would be bourne by the seller. The seller will get the sales value less fees associated with the sale (listing fee and insertion fee, not sure how additional extras and shop fees will be accounted for yet).

    I'm not sure how they are going to split paypal transactions though, and how it will look to the buyer. My delcampe sales come through as a direct sale to the customer in paypal, there is no way that I'm aware of for deductions to be made. Ebay acheves the fee split by making paypal payments indirect, i.e. into ebay payments. Will Delcampe be acheiving something similar by having paypal payments made into mangopay where they can deduct fees, or is there some paypal workaround I'm unaware of?
  • grahamshanghai
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    The video mentioned May/June as a timeframe for the next changes, but they are still working on the implementation so is not set in stone.

    As you suggest, my understanding is that the fees would be bourne by the seller. The seller will get the sales value less fees associated with the sale (listing fee and insertion fee, not sure how additional extras and shop fees will be accounted for yet).

    I'm not sure how they are going to split paypal transactions though, and how it will look to the buyer. My delcampe sales come through as a direct sale to the customer in paypal, there is no way that I'm aware of for deductions to be made. Ebay acheves the fee split by making paypal payments indirect, i.e. into ebay payments. Will Delcampe be acheiving something similar by having paypal payments made into mangopay where they can deduct fees, or is there some paypal workaround I'm unaware of?
    Thanks, appreciated !

    I understand that re fees. But now, if I sell something for £10, the buyer has no visibility about how much of that is Delcampe fees (or my stock cost, Paypal fees, profit etc). Under the new idea, the buyer will see that he is being charged for Delcampe fees (an extra £1), which some may simply see as an extra £1 for the seller for no additional work. That may put off some buyers (and I buy here as well for my collection so that may include myself !).

    I see that Mr Delcampe makes the argument that - put simply - buyers should "support" sellers by paying more (his example of bakers etc). I don't agree - buyers have no moral obligation to give me income. Rather, it is my job as a seller to run the business and price things sufficiently attractively so I make a profit.

    And I agree it is unclear on Paypal transactions !
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  • stevehillstamps
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    Reading through the last of the french forum questions has left me even more confused. It seems I was incorrect and that fees will be charged directly to the buyer rather than to the seller.

    How does that work with EU/UK law that prices shown must be inclusive of all typical fees and taxes to the consumer, one that is tightening with time. A buyer should not need a maths degree to calculate their liablility (although some sellers seem to forget this)

    How will refunds work? A buyer should receive the full amount back in the case of issues. Will fees be refunded or will buyers be left holding a service charge for items they did not receive or were faulty?

    Will sellers need to reprice every item to give a correct final price? My minimum item price is more than double what it would be exclusive of delcampe fees. Thankfully the Decampe Multiple Changes interface makes this fairly easy but communication needs to be made clearer on this.

    There is also a mention that there may no longer be volume or club plus discounts on these sales fees and the amounts are being reviewed, so there is the final value fee increase I was fearing. They have deliberately not set out the new fees as yet. I'd be surprised if they go down from the GBP0.14 per item and 7% FV fee currently charged to Gold Club+.
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    Reading through the last of the french forum questions has left me even more confused. It seems I was incorrect and that fees will be charged directly to the buyer rather than to the seller.

    How does that work with EU/UK law that prices shown must be inclusive of all typical fees and taxes to the consumer, one that is tightening with time. A buyer should not need a maths degree to calculate their liablility (although some sellers seem to forget this)

    How will refunds work? A buyer should receive the full amount back in the case of issues. Will fees be refunded or will buyers be left holding a service charge for items they did not receive or were faulty?

    Will sellers need to reprice every item to give a correct final price? My minimum item price is more than double what it would be exclusive of delcampe fees. Thankfully the Decampe Multiple Changes interface makes this fairly easy but communication needs to be made clearer on this.

    There is also a mention that there may no longer be volume or club plus discounts on these sales fees and the amounts are being reviewed, so there is the final value fee increase I was fearing. They have deliberately not set out the new fees as yet. I'd be surprised if they go down from the GBP0.14 per item and 7% FV fee currently charged to Gold Club+.
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  • stevehillstamps
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    Final thought from me for now, how does this change affect our tax situation as sellers, and how should this be declared on Customs Forms?

    Will the fees charged to buyers be outside of our tax situation now? Where will these fees be domiciled and under what company?

    Eg I sell an item from the UK to an Italian seller outside of IOSS.

    Currently, I am responsible as a seller for declaring on my tax return the full amount received. You charge me all sales fees (with UK VAT), which I then declare as an allowable business expense on my tax return.

    The customs form shows the final amount paid including your fees.

    Under the new system I only receive the amount excluding fees of the sale. Is this what I declare for income tax (and VAT if sufficiently large) in the UK?

    Are the fees treated as a separate online transaction from the buyer for tax purposes, and how will your invoices, packing slips and statements make this clear? Will this second transaction be taxed in Luxemburg, Belgium, the UK or Italy for VAT purposes?

    How should this be declared if at all on the customs form? Should I be declaring only the physical value (and not the service charges) or the whole amount?

    Will mangopay be providing statements to prove income received by this route (your existing screens do not qualify as they do not have a starting balance)?
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    Final thought from me for now, how does this change affect our tax situation as sellers, and how should this be declared on Customs Forms?

    Will the fees charged to buyers be outside of our tax situation now? Where will these fees be domiciled and under what company?

    Eg I sell an item from the UK to an Italian seller outside of IOSS.

    Currently, I am responsible as a seller for declaring on my tax return the full amount received. You charge me all sales fees (with UK VAT), which I then declare as an allowable business expense on my tax return.

    The customs form shows the final amount paid including your fees.

    Under the new system I only receive the amount excluding fees of the sale. Is this what I declare for income tax (and VAT if sufficiently large) in the UK?

    Are the fees treated as a separate online transaction from the buyer for tax purposes, and how will your invoices, packing slips and statements make this clear? Will this second transaction be taxed in Luxemburg, Belgium, the UK or Italy for VAT purposes?

    How should this be declared if at all on the customs form? Should I be declaring only the physical value (and not the service charges) or the whole amount?

    Will mangopay be providing statements to prove income received by this route (your existing screens do not qualify as they do not have a starting balance)?
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  • grahamshanghai
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    Reading through the last of the french forum questions has left me even more confused. It seems I was incorrect and that fees will be charged directly to the buyer rather than to the seller.

    How does that work with EU/UK law that prices shown must be inclusive of all typical fees and taxes to the consumer, one that is tightening with time. A buyer should not need a maths degree to calculate their liablility (although some sellers seem to forget this)

    How will refunds work? A buyer should receive the full amount back in the case of issues. Will fees be refunded or will buyers be left holding a service charge for items they did not receive or were faulty?

    Will sellers need to reprice every item to give a correct final price? My minimum item price is more than double what it would be exclusive of delcampe fees. Thankfully the Decampe Multiple Changes interface makes this fairly easy but communication needs to be made clearer on this.

    There is also a mention that there may no longer be volume or club plus discounts on these sales fees and the amounts are being reviewed, so there is the final value fee increase I was fearing. They have deliberately not set out the new fees as yet. I'd be surprised if they go down from the GBP0.14 per item and 7% FV fee currently charged to Gold Club+.
    All this (and your other useful post) reinforces that we need a detailed written explanation of what is proposed in ENGLISH (and probably other languages too).

    I remain firmly of the view that the seller should bear the cost of Delcampe fees, and there is no need for any visibility of those fees to the buyer.

    I really do not understand the logic behind any of this !
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    All this (and your other useful post) reinforces that we need a detailed written explanation of what is proposed in ENGLISH (and probably other languages too).

    I remain firmly of the view that the seller should bear the cost of Delcampe fees, and there is no need for any visibility of those fees to the buyer.

    I really do not understand the logic behind any of this !
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  • grahamshanghai
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    OK, but I don't know of any other similar marketplace site (e.g. Ebay, Etsy, Amazon, Abebooks etc) which charges the buyer directly for fees of this kind. It is the seller who is using the site for marketing their items, using Delcampe's systems, and taking up space on Delcampe's servers - the fees for that service should be borne by the seller.

    It is also absolutely true that the seller is responsible for buying the postal service, and is thus responsible for the package until it reaches the buyer safely, although I don't see how the buyer paying the Delcampe fees would make any difference to that.

    This whole thing has certainly opened up "a can of worms", and Delcampe may come to regret doing this (on top of the aggravation caused by the payment system change a few weeks ago).
  • stevehillstamps
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    Customs already get to know the shipping costs (its a separate box in the uk). Its whether the delcampe fees should be included as well as they will be a separate charge (they are included as present as they are part of my costs).

    Its important to know how Delcampe are treating the fees for tax purposes, and that it is declared on invoices correctly. My guess is that buyers are going to double taxed on the fees

    VAT will be charged on fees first by delcampe at checkout - they are providing an electronic service that is liable for VAT, so should be charged in the buyers country at the applicable rate.

    Customs will not take into account tax already paid unless its covered by a recognised scheme, e.g. IOSS which fees will not fall under unless the entire package is paid under this). Tax on the full amount charged for the goods (including fees that have already been chared VAT at checkout) will be taken again at the border.
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    OK, but I don't know of any other similar marketplace site (e.g. Ebay, Etsy, Amazon, Abebooks etc) which charges the buyer directly for fees of this kind. It is the seller who is using the site for marketing their items, using Delcampe's systems, and taking up space on Delcampe's servers - the fees for that service should be borne by the seller.

    It is also absolutely true that the seller is responsible for buying the postal service, and is thus responsible for the package until it reaches the buyer safely, although I don't see how the buyer paying the Delcampe fees would make any difference to that.

    This whole thing has certainly opened up "a can of worms", and Delcampe may come to regret doing this (on top of the aggravation caused by the payment system change a few weeks ago).
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    Customs already get to know the shipping costs (its a separate box in the uk). Its whether the delcampe fees should be included as well as they will be a separate charge (they are included as present as they are part of my costs).

    Its important to know how Delcampe are treating the fees for tax purposes, and that it is declared on invoices correctly. My guess is that buyers are going to double taxed on the fees

    VAT will be charged on fees first by delcampe at checkout - they are providing an electronic service that is liable for VAT, so should be charged in the buyers country at the applicable rate.

    Customs will not take into account tax already paid unless its covered by a recognised scheme, e.g. IOSS which fees will not fall under unless the entire package is paid under this). Tax on the full amount charged for the goods (including fees that have already been chared VAT at checkout) will be taken again at the border.
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  • stevehillstamps
    stevehillstamps 100% (14520x)
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    Sebastian Delcampe has confirmed that translations are on the way for all supported languages. Hopefully that communication will clear things up further.
  • prescott9376
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    I have just watched the video. It was a little difficult to keep up with the subtitles but I got the Gist.
    I understand why the site is making changes & understand that there are many items cluttering up the servers that have been on for years but I'm not sure how I am going to react yet.

    As I understand it my prices will have a surcharge applied to them to cover the fees, which the buyer pays, but obviously the buyer will be looking for the best prices so it may mean we either lower our base prices or accept offers at a price lower than we normally would.

    The seller will have to pay a "Rent" on their shops depending on items in stock. Although my sales are increasing monthly, in the 2 years I have been active here, £19.95 is twice the amount I pay in fees now.

    The other thing, I dont know if I missed it, is the Club Gold fees.
    At the moment I just about break even on the fixed fee discount but who would get that discount in the proposed way of doing things? would it be the buyer? What would the seller get from membership? I know there is a list of advantages to Club Gold but for me the big one was the discount.

    I'm up to about 13,000 listings now and was aiming to top 30,000 this year but I think I'm going to have to hang fire on my listing activity until things become clearer in the coming months.
    To end on a positive note, since the new payments method came in I haven't had any NPBs.

    Paul
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    I have just watched the video. It was a little difficult to keep up with the subtitles but I got the Gist.
    I understand why the site is making changes & understand that there are many items cluttering up the servers that have been on for years but I'm not sure how I am going to react yet.

    As I understand it my prices will have a surcharge applied to them to cover the fees, which the buyer pays, but obviously the buyer will be looking for the best prices so it may mean we either lower our base prices or accept offers at a price lower than we normally would.

    The seller will have to pay a "Rent" on their shops depending on items in stock. Although my sales are increasing monthly, in the 2 years I have been active here, £19.95 is twice the amount I pay in fees now.

    The other thing, I dont know if I missed it, is the Club Gold fees.
    At the moment I just about break even on the fixed fee discount but who would get that discount in the proposed way of doing things? would it be the buyer? What would the seller get from membership? I know there is a list of advantages to Club Gold but for me the big one was the discount.

    I'm up to about 13,000 listings now and was aiming to top 30,000 this year but I think I'm going to have to hang fire on my listing activity until things become clearer in the coming months.
    To end on a positive note, since the new payments method came in I haven't had any NPBs.

    Paul
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  • tris_nerima
    tris_nerima 98% (57609x)
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    I currently have over 100000 listings....what will Delacampe hope to charge me?
  • tris_nerima
    tris_nerima 98% (57609x)
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    Are the charges for large stores, monthly or annual?
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    I currently have over 100000 listings....what will Delacampe hope to charge me?
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